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Thread: Meditation

  1. #41
    Senior Member Moui's Avatar
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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TR8TjCncvIw

    Curious video I stumbled upon. I don't think it was posted before, sorry if I missed that. I guess I could post about my experience with different meditation practices later.
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  2. #42
    Founder Luc's Avatar
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    Thanks for sharing, Moui.
    Keep walking. Just keep walking.

  3. #43
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    Highlights from an interview with psychologist Rick Hanson, Ph.D. (paraphrased) --


    Contemplative neuroscience is the study of what happens in the brain when people are doing contemplative practices, how the brain changes with such practices. The field of contemplative neuroscience is just exploding, in tandem with the explosion of knowledge about brain science in general.

    One of the enduring changes in the brain of those who routinely meditate is that the brain becomes thicker. In other words, those who routinely meditate build synapses, synaptic networks, and layers of capillaries (the tiny blood vessels that bring metabolic supplies such as glucose or oxygen to busy regions).

    This happens in two major regions of the brain. One is in the pre-frontal cortex, located right behind the forehead. It’s involved in the executive control of attention – of deliberately paying attention to something. This change makes sense because that’s what you're doing when you meditate or engage in a contemplative activity.

    The second brain area that gets bigger is a very important part called the insula. The insula tracks both the interior state of the body and the feelings of other people, which is fundamental to empathy. So, people who routinely tune into their own bodies – through some kind of mindfulness practice – make their insula thicker, which helps them become more self-aware and empathic.


    One of the useful things we can do is use our attention. Mindful attention is something like a combination spotlight and vacuum cleaner that illuminates what it rests upon and sucks it into the brain. Neuroplasticity is turbocharged for whatever is in the field of focused attention. And while neurons that fire together do wire together in terms of unconscious, routine habits, the neurons that fire in the focal field of attention, particularly sustained attention – wow! – those neurons really, really wire together. It’s how Mother Nature wants us to learn from our conscious experiences.

    It’s totally understandable that the untrained mind is continually scanning for either something to want or something to fear – in other words, for a problem to solve. That’s why, as William James said, an education of attention would be an education par excellence. If we don’t have control over that spotlight and vacuum cleaner, then we pretty much have no control over how our brain is changing over time.


    When we base our intention to pay attention on words such as "I'm paying attention," we are setting the intention "top down." This lights up the prefrontal cortex, the part of the brain behind the forehead where there are a lot of executive systems. When we base our intention to pay attention on breathing or an emotional sense of being, we are setting the intention "bottom up." This engages the limbic system, the subcortical regions underneath the cortex, which involve emotions. This may lead to more emotional rewards.


    It’s important to calm down sympathetic arousal, and the way to do that is to activate the parasympathetic wing of the nervous system. This is the rest-and-digest part of the autonomic nervous system, the part that keeps us on an even keel. A great way to activate the parasympathetic system is through our exhalations, because the parasympathetic system handles exhaling. As few as three to ten long exhalations will light up the parasympathetic circuits and calm down sympathetic arousal. Similarly, because the parasympathetic system handles digestion, relaxing the tongue or the lips also helps to light up this system.


    To be mindful, to overcome the constant hijacking of the monkey mind, we rest our attention on one thing, such as the sensations of breathing, a loving-kindness phrase, or a prayer. To hold that focus in the field of attention requires holding it in what’s called working memory. The neural substrate of working memory has a kind of gate that is either open or closed. When it’s closed, the contents of it stay there, and what that translates to in our experience is that we maintain steadiness of mind. We are able to stay with whatever we want to pay attention to. The way the gate works is through dopamine, a neurotransmitter that tracks rewards. A steady flow of dopamine keeps the gate closed. What pops the gate open is either a drop in dopamine, when a feeling of reward falls away, or a spike in dopamine, when new and sweeter rewards are introduced, distracting us from what we were paying attention to.

    So, when you encourage feelings of well-being, you’re doing two things. You’re creating a steady flow of dopamine, which keeps the gate closed, and because you’re directing a highly rewarding flow of dopamine, you cannot get a spike of it. Those two things keep the gate of working memory closed and thereby steady the mind.


    When you create a contemplative state and regard the field of awareness as boundless space (usually with eyes closed) this may activate lateral networks – circuits on the side of the head that are associated with mindful, open, spacious awareness. It moves people out of the conventional state of mind in which the circuits in the middle of the brain are busy planning, thinking about the past, using language, and engaging in abstraction, all with a strong sense of self, of me-myself-and-I. Although there’s a place for that, modern life overemphasizes the activation of these midline networks, and because neurons that fire together wire together, we get a strong buildup in those regions. So it takes training to stably activate the lateral networks. One of the ways to activate the lateral networks is through a panoramic view. There are a couple of others, such as not knowing and not needing things to make sense, but one of the easiest is cultivating a sense of boundless awareness – a bird's-eye, panoramic view.


    These are just selected highlights. He describes a nice, low-key way to calm and focus attention in five steps about half way down the page --

    http://www.noetic.org/noetic/issue-n...uroplasticity/
    Meds free since June 2005.

    "An initiation into shamanic healing means a devaluation of all values, an overturning of the profane world, a peeling away of inveterate handed-down notions of the world, liberation from everything preconceived. For that reason, shamanism is closely connected with suffering. One must suffer the disintegration of one's own system of thought in order to perceive a new world in the higher space."
    -- Holger Kalweit

  4. #44
    Senior Member Moui's Avatar
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    Yeah, it's a bit of a long post.. had to cut it in two. You can use it as a sleep aid if nothing more!

    I've been meditating somewhat on-off since last September-ish? (mindfulness and metta). I also tried meditating in a severe state back in 2010. I've had many week and month long breaks but now I'm trying to get into a regular routine. I'm still a complete novice and learning but I figured I could post my experiences so far. I have a pretty utilitarian view on meditation and I tend to steer clear of the religious/mystical side of things. If I become enlightened then I'll take it but I'm not searching for spirituality :). I hope buddha forgives me. I am not sure all the teachings that apply to a monk in the Himalayas can be directly imported to someone in the industrialized, capitalist western world. But still many I think are applicable and maybe the positive-rewiring of neural networks can help us heal faster and come out of this as stronger, wiser? This is my take/review on these different meditation practices and in relation to ssri wd. Your nervous system may be different. I think like with exercise, supplements and everything if you start having bad experiences you should not continue. I've found help with some of these so I decided to share.

    The types of meditation I've tried;
    Mindfulness : both 1.open awareness and 2.focused attention, i.e. 1.observing thoughts come and go, 'witnessing' them rather than getting carried away in thought. 2. focusing on the sensation of the breath and gently bringing the attention back to it whenever it drifts away)
    Metta : also called compassion or loving-kindness meditation, generating good-will towards yourself and others.
    Mantra : repeating a short phrase, inducing relaxation

    I find there's some overlap but these are all very different practices. I've also looked into the so called Transcendental Meditation, which was referred to before in this thread and the Maharishi-effect. I'll get back to that later.

    There is plenty of free material if you google (I have also bookmarked so much but it's mixed with all the ssri-stuff) so if you wish to try some of these I'll let someone wiser and more experienced guide you more in detail. :)

    Mindfulness first: I haven't done enough mindfulness to really talk about the benefits. I only started doing the focused attention pretty recently. There are some I've noticed, being more in control of upsetting (social) situations and able to notice myself getting upset and then refocusing my attention to a more helpful neutral stance. Being more aware of my triggers and such. I feel my mind is clearer and better focused especially during the 'after-glow' of meditation practice. But as I have many variables in my situation I can't say what's what, I feel better in general than 6 months back. It's not earth-shattering, I'm still me with my problems- but there have been a few situations in which I handled myself better than I would have before. This is by far the hardest practice for me at least (which I suppose is why I should start focusing on this even more-to strenghten those neural networks) . People sometimes talk about mindfulness meditation as something that is like relaxing in a hot bath. And it can be, absolutely, sometimes. But other times it's not comfortable. Part of the practice is to learn to not always crave comfort or chase away uncomfortable thoughts/feelings/emotions/sensations. It teaches you to be with what is. Like in the video I posted earlier I also think of it in a similar way as I think about my workout routine. Sometimes my mind is like a wild ocean, constantly going back to thoughts like I wonder how long time has passed already, I feel hungry, thinking of tasks I need to do after meditating, stuff that happened yesterday etc. Honestly, most of the time it's like this. And always bringing back the focus to the breath. This is much different from the other meditations as metta and mantra on the other hand I know will feel great. I tried mindfulness in an acute state in 2010 and I quickly gave up as it felt very uncomfortable to sit quietly with the ruminating intrusive thoughts, depression, anxiety and I was not getting immediate results. There are definitely levels of difficulty in mindfulness practice, and it's easier to start out with the light weights and add more. The better I feel emotionally, physically etc. the easier it is to stay mindful. Something like having a headache, being hungry or having had an argument with someone recently will make it more difficult. So for these reasons if you decide to start practicing mindfulness in WD it can be a bit like starting at the olympic level thanks to all the symptoms and neuro-emotions (I like that term). It can feel a bit like going to the gym for the first time and racking up 500 pounds on the barbell and trying to bench press that. On the other hand as the WD eases the practice only gets easier. There is no concept of 'fail' in meditation, it all adds up so don't be discouraged. Be forgiving to yourself and take it easy with the duration is what I would advise. Something I've seen mentioned a lot is the Jon Kabat-Zinn mindfulness based stress reduction, which I haven't yet familiarized myself with.
    Acceptance. Time. Habit.

  5. #45
    Senior Member Moui's Avatar
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    Metta: This one I haven't seen mentioned in this thread before. I only found out about this compassion/loving-kindness meditation last fall. I'll try to look through my bookmarks and post some of the very promising studies that have come out. It's another popular Buddhist meditation (Mindfulness being the #1 in western world) Metta is used in substance abuse WD, too! I have not tried it in a severe state, but for natural troubles (and mild-moderate post-reinstatement troubles I had) I find it works great. And it tends to make me more assertive. I've read that for some it can take time and be difficult at first, but I find it much easier. It works especially great for anger (wow, love is the antidote of anger?) I find it soothing and often start with this before moving on to mindfulness. It always leaves me with a calm, kind, centered, balanced, joyous afterglow. Again, there's better instructors than me but in short you repeat phrases of good will first toward yourself, then a person you like, a neutral person(bus driver), a difficult person/someone you dislike (this one can be very beneficial, it's the hardest too) and finally to all. You go through everyone during the same sitting and there are many variations. The content of the phrases doesn't matter as long as the intention is of good will. Common ones are something like "May you be well. May you be healthy. May you be safe... etc". Honestly you could wish them strong erectile function if you wish, it doesn't matter. It's just to keep you focused on that loving intention so it helps to, in whatever way feels natural, imagine them/you receiving this love and blessing, being safe and so forth. Do I believe I'm actually sending these people something? No, but it's creating within me a genuine caring which then helps both me and those I interact with. It's also different from expecting these things, it's a wish for wellness. I had bad sinus congestion and in one of the phrases I always include I was wishing myself health, but I don't expect to actually have it go away. I picture the person in my mind (also their name: Moui, may you be ....) and often before moving to the next person I imagine giving them a hug. Oh yeah, I'm a hippie dude now for sure.. hey, I balance it by lifting weights and listening to angry metal music!

    I keep a timer on my phone with a gentle sound letting me know when the time is up. Sometimes I have a background sound from youtube. Time will slow down when you sit quietly. I have fiddled with different ways but right now I'm trying 10min metta ,short break, 10min mindfulness, short break ,and another 10minute of mindfulness. One total 30 minute sitting at morning, once at evening. This is actually quite a lot and I think it's easier to start with even less time to get to a steady routine. I tried jumping into 20 minute sittings and I had trouble with it.
    Both Metta and Mindfulness can and absolutely should also be incorporated (this might also start happening on it's own) outside the formal sitting practice. For example short moments during other daily activities, washing the dishes mindfully or sending kind thoughts to people you pass by when out in the town or shop.

    The mantra meditation à la moui
    : (I'm not even sure if it is a meditation or self-relaxation, breathing technique..what should I call it, it just came together when I was trying to cope with WD. I had tried taking a yoga class and tried many breathing exercises and other calming techniques, visual imagery etc. and put this together) If your symptoms are anywhere close to mine and you're wired similarly you might find some relief depending on the severity. I did not try in my last WD, which was worse but I did in the first when I still had severe symptoms. I was not able to sleep without doing this to calm my system down to at least a bearable level. I have also used this outside of WD in the army when I had to calm myself down to get to sleep during the 1-2 week long outdoor exercises that imitate a war situation. Sometimes after 24 (or more) hours of physically and mentally exhausting work I would get a 1-3, max 4 hour chance to sleep,possibly during daylight when an artillery battery was firing nearby, drenched in sweat and dirt and feeling sick and hungry and pissed off, in the go-go-go-mode and whatnot. So I really wanted to get to sleep as quick as possible because I knew that the next chance to sleep would be a long time away. This is by far for me personally the most central nervous system sedating/relaxing/sleep inducing thing I know of. It works best in combination with other things that promote these same things (herbal tea, after hot shower or bath). When I was feeling really badly I did this under the shower, first warm water and then cool water to calm my whole body.
    The mantra consists of the inhalation part and the exhalation part. While inhaling I either think or softly whisper the mantra. I take a deep and full breath in through the nose(or nose and mouth if you whisper) and let the chest and especially the abdomen expand (go for the pregnant belly, but again don't make it forcefully uncomfortable) and say "And". I actually do this in english because it flows better than my native language. Pause briefly and on the exhalation part I slowly release the air and really draw that exhalation out. To get a feel for what I mean you can hiss and when the air leaves between your tongue and teeth you can really draw it out looooooong. I repeat the phrase "Deeper". But really draw it out "Deeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeepeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeer ". So together it becomes "and deeper... and deeper... and deeper... and deeper... and deeper..." I quickly timed myself and it took 2.2 seconds on the inhalation and 14.1 seconds on the exhalation. Again, don't force it as that will just make you gasp for air. Go for what feels natural. I do this eyes closed and on the "deeper" part I imagine myself sinking. It's very hard to put into words how it feels, but there is a slight pressure on my eyelids. This will often induce yawning and even if it doesn't I sometimes let out yawns and really exaggerate it. These all together really kick the parasympathetic nervous system in action and calm down my cns.

    And finally my take on the Transcendental Meditation-movement:
    I find the whole TM-movement quite dubious. At first I was surprised to find that nowhere in the web could you find any information as to what the practice actually consists of. Then I found out that the only way to learn this secretive technique was by visiting a local TM-teacher and paying a significant amount of money (100s of euros). I did some further digging up and found some ex-tm meditator/teacher websites, where old members were exposing cult-like activities within the movement. Maharishi has openly harped on the other styles of meditation and said TM is much more powerful than mindfulness and the other practices and has made very mystical claims of transcending all other states of being. Claims of levitating etc. Yet there's very little info (all that's on the web are sort of infomercials by tm-teachers that promise great health benefits) and all the studies are by people linked to the TM-movement. There were also other remarks of his which struck to me as a bit odd like the ban he ordered not wanting to "waste the nectar of TM on the scorpion nation" Britain in protest of the Iraq war. This same hostility came up when some meditators had questioned the problems they had encountered with their meditation. Eventually through digging I did find what the meditation practice consists of and it's basicly just a mantra meditation. You are given a supposedly secret phrase that you must never say out loud which is unique to you, but is actually just a combination of your age and sex. While the meditation can probably be relaxing there's no need to get involved with this group, in my opinion.

    Fin.
    Acceptance. Time. Habit.

  6. #46
    Senior Member Moui's Avatar
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    Oh, and during the mantra the exhalation is through the mouth. There was some reason for this that I got from a breathing exercise but I've forgotten it.
    Acceptance. Time. Habit.

  7. #47
    Founder Sheila's Avatar
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    Thanks, Moui. Very interesting to hear you link different meditation methods to different effects in your life. And that is a helpful personal method you came up with – you’re breathing out longer than you’re breathing in so, as Rick Hanson says just above you, that’s good for activating the parasympathetic system. I'm so impressed by how hard you're worked at this.
    Meds free since June 2005.

    "An initiation into shamanic healing means a devaluation of all values, an overturning of the profane world, a peeling away of inveterate handed-down notions of the world, liberation from everything preconceived. For that reason, shamanism is closely connected with suffering. One must suffer the disintegration of one's own system of thought in order to perceive a new world in the higher space."
    -- Holger Kalweit

  8. #48
    Senior Member Moui's Avatar
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    Well, it started more out of desperation than anything. :) I've been unemployed for the vast majority of my ssri-life so I've had time. Even in those times I always felt I had to do something constructive to stay sane. For me it's been the triangle of improving body-mind-nutrition.
    Acceptance. Time. Habit.

  9. #49
    Founder Sheila's Avatar
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    I hear you. I have always resisted meditation, and might still not be doing it if I didn’t have to. But, since w/d, I cannot fall asleep unless I meditate.
    Meds free since June 2005.

    "An initiation into shamanic healing means a devaluation of all values, an overturning of the profane world, a peeling away of inveterate handed-down notions of the world, liberation from everything preconceived. For that reason, shamanism is closely connected with suffering. One must suffer the disintegration of one's own system of thought in order to perceive a new world in the higher space."
    -- Holger Kalweit

  10. #50
    Founder Sheila's Avatar
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    Anterior Cingulate

    From a lecture by Dan Siegel, M.D. in which he made a fascinating observation.

    Many of us feel like we're failing at meditation (or relaxation techniques) because we have to repeatedly bring our attention back to whatever it is we're trying to focus on (an image, a mantra, the breath, etc.), and repeatedly let go of thoughts about chores, fears, self-criticism, etc.

    But, Dan Siegel says that it's actually *beneficial* to lose focus and then re-focus.

    Every time you do that, you are probably developing your anterior cingulate of your prefrontal cortex. It's like the gear shift for attention. The more you lose focus and then re-focus, the more you develop your capacity to shift attention.

    IOW, meditation (and relaxation techniques) are not only healing to us when we're "in the zone," they're healing to us when we keep falling out of the zone and keep trying to get back to the zone, even if *that's* all we do for ten minutes.

    By repeatedly and gently trying to focus, you're increasing the neuroplasticity of the gear shifter. It's like lifting weights for your ability to choose where you put your attention.
    Meds free since June 2005.

    "An initiation into shamanic healing means a devaluation of all values, an overturning of the profane world, a peeling away of inveterate handed-down notions of the world, liberation from everything preconceived. For that reason, shamanism is closely connected with suffering. One must suffer the disintegration of one's own system of thought in order to perceive a new world in the higher space."
    -- Holger Kalweit

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