7 Months - No Improvement and new symptoms

[Needinghelp]

It's ruminations/obsessive thoughts/intrusive thougts/OCD - one of the most common symptoms in WD. They are *not* real you, they are caused by WD, and will be, gradually, getting better. Here's one of the threads on it;

http://antidepressantwithdrawal.info...ht=ruminations

That is not uncommon to not only experience worsening that far off (7 and more months off), but also hit the worst point of WD. It all depends on a given case. It does *not* mean you won't be improving. WD is probably the most absurd experience there is. Hardly anything is linear, all works more in cycles of worsening and improvement. The thing is that, sooner or later, the average mass of improvements is bigger than worsenings.

I wouldnt really say its much worsening of symptoms, but actually just a standstill for a long time... Months. Is this normal?

[Needinghelp]

NH, I am probably one of the extremely bad cases in terms of WD recovery. My first 20 months off were one living hell. THe first noticable improvement was not earlier than 19 months off. And even after that very nasty waves occurred which made me feel back at square one.
And, just like you, very nasty memories popping up again and again, and in my first 3-9 months off I even hallucinated almost non-stop about my former abuser, the scariest and meanest person I ever met in my life, now about 25 years ago.

But the good news: even I started to recover after about 2 years off, and now, 5,5 years off I feel a massive recovery though some nassty residual symptoms are still there.
This may sound discouraging but just accept the fact that it can take a couple of years for your nervous system to even come into a state of partial recovery, which it can use as a base for further recovery steps.
I still believe in 100% healing from this. And even myo mother notices that I am doing way better again than, say, one year ago. And it feels that way, too.
So do not give up. Losing 3-5 years of your life due to WD is flabbergasting but I now not consider it anymore as a complete loss, I leanred so many new things that I feel even glad I have this experience and new knowledge in my pocket and will be my own expert for the rest of my life instead of relying on well-paid pharma squibs.

Hi Claudius, i cant find any of your old posts while in withdrawal, so im not sure with which symptoms you struggled, but it doesnt really matter, you are almost recovered and i must say you give me hope, like everyone on the sites. Its just discouraging to hear of people who are far out and still struggling, especially with my symptoms. I just hope its true that this horrible DR/DP really goes away and that one day my mind will be clear again. 7 months is not long, but it sure feels like an eternity. 2 years for you must have felt really long. Did you ever doubt you will recover? Especially those 19 months of no improvements?

[Needinghelp]

I have had memories pop up like you describe. It's totally random and the memories span decades. I have no idea what it is probably just neurons misfiring or rewiring. It's hard to say...

Regarding people recovering there are whole lists of people at other websites who have fully recovered, had children, started new careers, etc.

People do recover, but i have seen alot (Too many) who still have problems 8-10 years out. I know its not the norm, but do you think even those people can still fully recover? Can full recovery take place even after 10 years? I really do hope so. I wish people wouldnt just vanish from the sites and leave others wondering if they recovered.

[Needinghelp]

I'm thoroughly convinced that people recover fully. I have read too many anecdotes.

Unfortunately, new symptoms can appear and old symptoms return. That's the nature of this beast. But, still you will recover fully.

The memory thing is very common. I, too, have had intense, vivid memories from my whole life -- some significant, and some like standing on a street corner -- why the heck is that still important?

It slowly abates as you heal. Some of it I think is memories returning that you may have lost during the use of the meds or the initial phase of w/d without realizing it. Some of it might be healing of trauma.

The memory problem i have is a bit different. I dont mind all the memories pop up, its the fear thats attached to them. Im not sure why. Maybe its because im mourning my old life back and i know ill never have that back again. If i listen to a familiar song that i used to like a few years ago, instant fear and panic. Not nice at all.

Do people who suffered from an adverse reaction heal too? Is it the same as normal withdrawal?

[Needinghelp]

If you had BBM blackberry I would give you a contact of someone who recovered in a few months from an SSRI wd. And like I told you, iv spoke with robert whitaker nd charly G, both insurred tht people do heal... You will too, as long as you stick to water, healthy diet, and no meds, you'll be fine! But try living your life, regardless of how you feel, go to the gym, talk with friends, no matter how the derealisation has worsen, distraction is your best friend. I'm sure your waves will lessen in their severity as time goes on.

Godbless.
Dave

Thanks Dave. Im trying to PM you, but your inbox is full!

[Needinghelp]

NH, I am very close to you in time; I took my last dose 7 months and 15 days aprox.

Let me tell you this: I have EXACTLY the same ruminations and fears about not healing from this.

But you know what? I´M HEALING!! My anxiety levels are lower, anhedonia, better; my worst and most feared symptom, insomnia is getting slowly better...

NH, DON´T LET YOUR FEAR BLIND YOU.I also have fear and doubts; I am 59 yo, and I feel I have so much more to live, and in a better way than the life I had before.

You will heal, but you have to help yourself, to make it easier.

Im at exactly 7 months off today. Who knows, maybe i might be feeling better soon... I do hope so

[Needinghelp]

The fear of not knowing if im going to suffer like this for years on end is really getting to me now. I dont know what to do.
My mom also decided not to go to the doctor as she says her pain is gone. Im so worried and stressed out all the time. How can anyone heal with constant stressors? Maybe thats why im still in hell.

I feel like im being left behind. Everyone seems to be feeling better (The ones who came joined pp the same time as me) but not me. I did feel a bit better in December, but now its been 3 solid months of no relief, some days much worse.

[Claudius]

Hi Claudius, i cant find any of your old posts while in withdrawal, so im not sure with which symptoms you struggled, but it doesnt really matter, you are almost recovered and i must say you give me hope, like everyone on the sites. Its just discouraging to hear of people who are far out and still struggling, especially with my symptoms. I just hope its true that this horrible DR/DP really goes away and that one day my mind will be clear again. 7 months is not long, but it sure feels like an eternity. 2 years for you must have felt really long. Did you ever doubt you will recover? Especially those 19 months of no improvements?

It is right you will not find any post of me while in early WD because this site did not exist on those days.
My first posts were on another support site (Paxilprogress) but my profile there is deleted now for privacy reasons. I did not find PP until 18 months off and I still cannot grab how I did survive that period.
I almost got indulged in a law suit because I threathened my old abuser to kill him (my emotions were totally bizarre and getting out of the roof) and I was compeltely unable to work due to the horrific WD symptoms. Some people, including my GP and some familly members, tried to push me back to meds but how totally wrecked I was, I still realized that my extreme bad condition was somehow related to the meds and going back was no option anymore. (Of course, tapering would be the best option but I did not now about that). And my refusal to take more meds was for sseveral people whom I trusted before a reason to label me as "stubborn" and "not listening to doctors", something I am proud of now.

So yes, I was closer to suicide than one can ever get. It was the love for my mum and my deep feeling that this was not the "real" me, together wth some fuinancial support which made me able to travel through this endless long, dark and dirty tunnel.
And there is really some light at the end of it. I still cope with old trauma's and rejections, bot for the WD poart I am fully confident in complete recovery, even after a years long journey though something worse than hell.

[Needinghelp]

It is right you will not find any post of me while in early WD because this site did not exist on those days.
My first posts were on another support site (Paxilprogress) but my profile there is deleted now for privacy reasons. I did not find PP until 18 months off and I still cannot grab how I did survive that period.
I almost got indulged in a law suit because I threathened my old abuser to kill him (my emotions were totally bizarre and getting out of the roof) and I was compeltely unable to work due to the horrific WD symptoms. Some people, including my GP and some familly members, tried to push me back to meds but how totally wrecked I was, I still realized that my extreme bad condition was somehow related to the meds and going back was no option anymore. (Of course, tapering would be the best option but I did not now about that). And my refusal to take more meds was for sseveral people whom I trusted before a reason to label me as "stubborn" and "not listening to doctors", something I am proud of now.

So yes, I was closer to suicide than one can ever get. It was the love for my mum and my deep feeling that this was not the "real" me, together wth some fuinancial support which made me able to travel through this endless long, dark and dirty tunnel.
And there is really some light at the end of it. I still cope with old trauma's and rejections, bot for the WD poart I am fully confident in complete recovery, even after a years long journey though something worse than hell.

Wow, no internet support for 18 months. That mustve been really frightening for you. I am very happy that you made it to a safe place and that you are alomst fully recovered. Yes, i have the suicidal thoughts alot too... But i could never bring myself to do it and leave my mother alone. It would be too painful for her to bare.

[Mike]

People do recover, but i have seen alot (Too many) who still have problems 8-10 years out. I know its not the norm, but do you think even those people can still fully recover? Can full recovery take place even after 10 years? I really do hope so. I wish people wouldnt just vanish from the sites and leave others wondering if they recovered.

What I know about myself (8 years) is even though things are still bad I've come a long way and each year there is some small amount of improvement. The other thing that gives me hope is that every once in a while I feel a lot more like myself. That really lifts my spirits. So I am going to just keep up the good fight and see what each year brings me. But remember you are really in a different category at this point... There's a much greater chance that you'll heal by about 2 years (the norm) than several years down the line. You also have a few things in your favor that we've talked about before...

You asked again if it is normal to feel as bad as you do at 7 months. YES. It's totally, totally normal. I had zero improvement until 13 months. You may also feel worse at times and that too is totally normal. Below is a quote from C. Heather Ashton, a physician who ran a benzodiazapine withdrawal clinic for 20 years. She is talking about benzos but having been through both protracte benzo and antidepressant withdrawal I can tell you that they are much more similar than different.

During benzodiazepine withdrawal, symptoms characteristically wax and wane, varying in severity and type from day to day, week to week, and even during the course of a day. Some symptoms come and go; others may take their place. There is no need to be discouraged by these wave-like recurrences; the waves become less severe and less frequent as time passes. Typically "Windows" of normality, when you feel positively well for a few hours or days, appear after some weeks; gradually the "Windows" become more frequent and last longer, while any intervening discomfort ebbs away.

It is impossible to give an exact time for the duration of withdrawal symptoms. It depends on where you start from, how much support you need and receive, how you manage your taper and many other factors. With slow tapering, some long-term users have virtually lost all their symptoms by the time they take their last tablet, and in the majority symptoms disappear within a few months. Vulnerability to extra stress may last somewhat longer and a severe stress may - temporarily - bring back some symptoms. Whatever your symptoms, it is best not to dwell on them. Symptoms are just symptoms after all and most of them in withdrawal are not signs of illness but signals of recovery. Furthermore, as your mind clears, you can work out more and more effective ways to deal with them so that they become less significant.

One reassuring finding from many clinical studies is that eventual success in withdrawal is not affected by duration of use, dosage or type of benzodiazepine, rate of withdrawal, severity of symptoms, psychiatric diagnosis, or previous attempts at withdrawal. Thus from almost any starting point, the motivated long-term user can proceed in good heart.